Monday, May 9, 2011

AAP Shot Themselves in the Foot

There is much wailing and gnashing of teeth by the medical profession and gun control advocates over the proposed Florida bill to prevent Pediatriciansfrom discussing firearms w/ their patients.

Well, in all honesty they brought it on themselves. In the early 2000's, the AAP, AMA and APA joined together to form the Doctors Against Handgun Injury. This group actively pursued handgun bans and other forms of firearm restrictions when making gun control a 'public health issue' seemed a workable solution.

The AAP has long held anti-gun positions. Here are their 'recommendations':
Advice to parents

The best way to keep your children safe from injury or death from guns is to NEVER have a gun in the home.

Do not purchase a gun, especially a handgun.
Remove all guns present in the home.
Talk to your children about the dangers of guns, and tell them to stay away from guns.
Find out if there are guns in the homes where your children play. If so, talk to the adults in the house about the dangers of guns to their families.
Along w/ the debunked Kellerman nonsense, this is what the AAP endorses. So it's not, as some have claimed, just the NRA being a bunch of knee jerk gun extremists and Dr's just wanting to talk about safe gun handling/storage for kids, this is the response to a long term political effort to demonize and ban guns in the home by a well funded and influential lobbying group.

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Sean D Sorrentino said...

If you like that article, try this one.

I've been arguing with the same clown for days.

Thirdpower said...

Yeah. He seems like a 'true believer'. ignoring the facts laid out in front of him.

Matt L. said...

Yes, a lot of doctors are ideological idiots when it comes to guns. There are already mechanisms to address this in place (anyone can make a complaint to a State Medical Board and by rule all complaints are investigated). Crapping on a 1A issue to protect 2A seems a bit like someone giving a blow-job to remain a virgin.

For the record, I hope this law doesn't prevent me from asking a patient with hearing loss, "Hey, do you use hearing protection when you shoot? Have you considered a suppressor? And, damn, have you seen the new Ruger Scout Rifle?"

Anonymous said...

Matt L.

I bet you practice often to keep your virginity.

Anonymous said...


I agree, "a lot of doctors are ideological idiots."

The rest are just plain idiots.

Chas said...

Anti-gun rights pediatricians abusing their position by taking advantage of their juvenile patients and interrogating them about their parents' gun ownership to advance their anti-gun rights, political agenda does not fall under the First Amendment.
It's patient abuse, and a form of child abuse and it should be prohibited by law.

Weer'd Beard said...

The wife got questioned once during a physical. The Doc fell back to standard Joyce Talking points, including Kellerman.

The wife knew the song and dance long before, and I mentioned before she went in that Joyce had been attempting to make inroads in the Physician world.

She had the doc backpedaling pretty quickly.

Craig said...

Has anyone seen the pro-gun crowd use the argument that entering firearm data into your medical records is just one small step from a defacto registration? I haven't run across it in the small sample of arguments that I have seen. Given the anti's fondness for small steps of infringement, it won't be long before any firearm notations in your medical records will be used against your freedom. In fact, Obamacare already has provisions for every bureaucrat and his buddy to see your medical records, but YOU aren't allowed to get copies. What a twisted world we live in.

Matt L. said...


Cute. Ad hominem. Grade school ad hominem at that. Strong work. You'll be starring in a Brady Campaign poetry slam next. For the record, if I had to cope with the botched abortions who'd settle for you, I would be practicing virginity. Now go leave the big boys and girls alone, do whatever it is that you do in the bathroom, and don't forget to shave the hair off the palms of your hands when you're through.

P.S.: Your mother should have used a longer coat hanger.

For everyone else,

That digression aside, I agree, there are physicians who abuse their privileges. But again, there are also mechanisms for dealing with it. Abusive physicians should be reported to their boards, and punished by censure or revocation of their privileges, and those rules should be enforced. And again, it's very easy to levy a complaint against a physician and there is very little burden of proof necessary to censure them. Medical boards are like the Star Chamber, and if you feel a doctor has been abusive, go ahead and use that power. But a wholesale abolition of lines of questioning in medicine is stupid. As stupid as Anonymous up there.

I'm as rabidly pro-gun-rights as the next reader of this blog, but on several occasions I've found it necessary (as in failure-to-meet-standard-of-care-and-commit-negligence-necessary) to ask people about gun ownership. On other circumstances, it's just comes up because someone shows me a picture of their hunting trip or sees an NRA pin on my jacket or car. Never once have I gone beyond my scope of practice to say whether or not someone should or shouldn't own a gun or how they should store it. But, sometimes it's relevant to why someone comes in to the office or the ER, and sometimes it's just something to talk politely about if they come in wearing an IDPA hat (you know we physicians are lazy/evil/uncaring of our patients if we don't make smalltalk on occasion).

I know the law has been curtailed to permit some of this, but in the end, it really pisses me off that people who have never had to deal with the realities of patient care suddenly decide what should be included in a doctor-patient discussion. Seriously, what's next? Someone saying sexual behavior isn't a doctor's business and that their HIV risk factors shouldn't be considered important in an exam? Some people have proposed this. Or heaven forbid a pediatrician should ask little Molly if she has a sex life, because that would never be important. (Don't you dare ask my little girl about sex! She'd never do that! Sure.)

Muzzling all doctors in order to gag a specific subset of ideologues strikes me as the same kind of logic that gun grabbers make when they say all guns should be removed for the sake of a few nut jobs.

Thirdpower said...

Matt L.:

If it's only a small subset of ideologues, why don't the rest work to change the official policy of the AAP to discourage firearm ownership?

They entered into the realm of political ideology and now their members are paying the price for it.

Anonymous said...

Dear Dr. Doolittle (a.k.a. Matt L):

Thank you very much for your glowing remarks. Such sentiments epitomize a deep respect for humankind. Based on your frenetic tirade, it appears as if you are a somewhat distraught individual. Did you take your Xanax today?

Accolades aside, do you think it appropriate to analogize Second Amendment rights to fellatio? Is it absurd for someone to find such denigrating remarks insulting and/or offensive? Why is this a First Amendment issue? Should patients paying for your services be forced to listen to your propaganda? Is the physician-patient setting the proper venue for the perpetuation of politically oriented views? Employees in the private sector do not enjoy First Amendment rights, why do you?

This is more than a pro-gun vs. anti-gun issue. It is a class war. Firearms will never be completely outlawed in this country. The elite, including the upper echelons of society, the politically well connected and the wealthy will always have guns. Guess which side the medical profession is on?

Ordinary citizens should not be trusted with guns because they lack the intelligence necessary to safely operate such complex and deadly mechanisms. Guess which side "stupid" is on?

Just ask Gov. Quinn, former-Mayor Daley, Pres. Obama, the Brady Campaign, the Joyce Foundation and its minions and the various professional entities mimicking the same views. The civilain populce should be disarmed!

While it is irrelevant to any First or Second Amendment issues, your behavior on this forum clearly indicates you would handle an inquisition into little Molly’s sex life with the adroitness of the Gestapo. As with the vast majority of physicians throughout this country, you exhibit little deference for humanity and worship the almighty dollar.

By the way, what does the “L” in your name stand for, “Loughner”?



Larry said...

When I took my youngest in for a well baby check the doc asked if I was teaching him about guns and knives (he was about 2 at the time). I told the doc he was a bit short for the shotgun yet, but he was hell with a set of throwing stars.
When I got the wide eyed stare I told him "That's redneck for 'mind your own f*cking business.'"